>I’m having trouble intonating the 4th melody
>string using the formula for BassBottom tuning
> because it keeps being sharp. I tune it C#
> no offset (at fret 2), then intonate +2 cents
> at the 14th fret, where I intonate. And then
> it’s increasingly sharp further up the fretboard.
> This bugs the owner.

Now intonations can change over time, and I cannot see the instrument, but it sounds like the owner has a misunderstanding about how Feiten works, and the authorized shop is not able to explain it to him. (Or maybe this particular shop doesn’t quite understand the Feiten system, could that be?)

Here’s our shop’s response –

Thanks for writing.

First I want to make sure I correctly understand what you said –

You have set the 4th melody string intonation to no offset at fret two.
Then you set the 4th melody string intonation to +2 cents at fret fourteen.
Then you noticed that the string is sharp *above* fret fourteen, that is frets 15-25.
Is that correct?

If I have understood you correctly, then here’s what I think is true …

Of course the string is at least 2 cents sharp above fret fourteen, because the formula tells you to make it sharp by two cents at fret fourteen.

And in fact, the string should continue to become sharper as you move further toward the bridge. For example, fret 17 or fret 20 or fret 25 should be *more* than 2 cents sharp.

And of course, any string that is set to be sharp *halfway* up the fretboard will be even more sharper higher up the fretboard. If you had zero offset at fret fourteen, then you’d expect zero sharpness above fret fourteen. But if you’ve sharped the string at fret fourteen, then as the string length is reduced as you move higher up the fretboard toward the bridge, so it will continue to become increasingly sharp at each successive fret as you move further up the neck.

As you go *down* the fretboard from fourteen toward fret two, of course the sharpness will go away until there is no sharpness at fret two. Because that’s how we set it.

Another Illustrative Example of How Buzz Feiten Intonation Works

If you had set the offset at fret 22, for example, to +2 cents, then as you came down to fret 14, then fret 14 would be *less* than 2 cents sharp. And so if you set fret 14 to be 2 cents sharp, then of course fret 18 or 21 or some higher fret will be more sharp.

In other words, that’s exactly what we set it to do. That’s what it’s doing. And that’s how it has to work.

It will not be different on any other string, and it will be exactly the same on any other string, where there is a greater sharpness at 14 than at fret 2.

Buzz Feiten Intonation and Your Ears

However, you may *notice* it less on some other strings. For example on bass strings and strings that are lower pitched, our ear hears less. And at lower frequencies, there will be less change one fret to the next in terms of actual frequency of vibration.

On some strings where the offset is less, there will be less additional sharpness further up the fretboard. So string #3 will be less, and there should be NO sharpness on strings #2 and #1.

Precision Fret-Placement Needed for Feiten Intonation System

Each fret is in one place, the same for all the strings, on parallel fret instruments, and so one string cannot act differently than another string. Even on fanned-fret instruments, the principle is the same.

And we use computer-controlled, high-precision machinery to cut the frets, so that we have no variance on the cutting of fretslots. That is, they’re not cut by hand, and there’s no human error when they’re cut. So we can assume that the fret is in the correct place, and of course it cannot be in the correct place for string #3 and string #5 and be in the wrong place for string  #4.

String Gauges and the Buzz Feiten System

There can also be some slight differences between plain and wound strings, and between one gauge and another. These are largely the differences that the Feiten intonation improves. But the formula you have is the one given us by the Feiten folks, and the strings gauges you have are the ones we used to set up the formulas. (If Fabrizio has changed to different gauges, then that’s a new can of worms!)

So What to Do?

We are left with this –

Now, that particular string #4 is the lowest-pitched plain string.

If you ears and the owner’s ears say that string #4 is “TOO SHARP” as you go up the frets, then the two of you should TRUST YOUR EARS.

That’s how Buzz Feiten and Greg Back developed the formula. They *listened* and set the offsets to what sounds the best to their ears.

So if you think that string #4 is going TOO MUCH sharp as you go up beyond fret 14, then CHANGE THE OFFSET at fret 14 to a lower value. Do this till it sounds correct to your EARS. Test against the other strings by playing simple major triads up and down the strings, if you want to really check your ears.

That’s what Buzz Feiten did.

How to Correctly Play While Setting Intonation

Now, one last thing –

As you test the intonation and as you set the intonation, PLEASE do this by TAPPING on the string. Do NOT fret the string and pluck it. Set the intonation at fret two by tapping the string, and set the intonation at fret fourteen by tapping the string. (You can get very different results picking and tapping, and this instrument is designed to be played by tapping.)

Tap ON the fret, and turn up your amp, and tap softly to do the work.

Happy intonation!

ShareThis

Electronic tuners have to have a ‘window’ of frequency that is acceptable. If the window is narrow, then it is very very difficult for the human to hit the exact spot where the light turns green.

But if the window is wide, the tuner is easier to use, but one string might actually be flat, and it’s inside the window, and the next string is sharp and it’s inside the window, and they are way the hell off against each other. Therefore, you will have better luck with any tuner that lets you see yourself getting closer to the correct spot. So this suggests a priority for tuners –

• A strobe tuner is best but they are expensive and large;
• A virtual strobe is next best (Peterson makes good ones)
• A tuner with a needle would be next best, if they’ve done a good job with it;
• A tuner with a row of lights next best; and
• A tuner with a single red/green light not very good.

Of course, if you tune carefully and often, then your ear gets better and better, and after a while you’re using the tuner, but your ear is telling you the truth.

In the end, the entire point is so that the instrument sounds good while you play it. And nothing helps like practice. Practice tuning.

ShareThis

ShareThis

It can slightly change the sounds coming out of the pickups because pickups are not spaced identically on the ‘bass’ and the ‘melody’ side, but this shouldn’t be much of an issue.

ShareThis

There is also the popular bass-strings tuning we call ‘Inverted Fifths’ which has some enthusiasts among touch-stylists. Yet you can still play the ‘Easy Touch-Style’ method in that tuning. Because this tuning is popular, upon request we will provide instruments with bass strings tuned this way, and the method book covers Inverted Fifths tuning as well as our standard tuning.

If you’re an existing bass player or guitar player taking up touch-style we suggest you try the standard ‘Bass Bottom’ tuning, because we think you’ll find it familiar, and it seems better for many types of music. And if you’re just starting out, we still suggest you try standard ‘Bass Bottom’ tuning. In our opinion, it’s much simpler, and faster to learn.

ShareThis

It’s the same idea. You don’t play them all at once. In fact, we start out just playing three strings just above fret two. If you play guitar or bass, your left hand already knows how to fret these notes, and you don’t need to pick or strum, so you just touch the string to the fret and it plays. Now here’s where you get lucky …

All of your ‘left hand learning’ was really just training your head, and your right hand is wired into the same head. What that means is that whatever your left hand knows, your right hand almost knows already. You’ll discover that your right hand can very quickly be playing like your left hand.

If you’ll start out with our standard ‘BassBottom’ tuning, you’ll notice that the left-hand set of strings are tuned exactly like a standard six-string bass. And the notes on the right-hand set of strings just above fret twelve are *identical* to the left-hand notes just above fret two. This means that you can play both hands identically; in fact you can train them simultaneously.

This method of play is somewhat easier to learn than guitar because the straight fourths tuning makes unnecessary learning additional scales and chords to deal with the ‘B’ string like on guitar. And it’s a little easier than piano because piano requires you to operate your left hand and right hand differently to move up a scale. In this method of play, you operate both hands exactly identically. The BassBottom tuning gives you the only two-handed instrument in the world which lets you play two-handed and operate both hands identically.

Pick up a free preview copy of our method book in the ‘Documents‘ section of this website — or subscribe to our free newsletter and we’ll send you the complete book as a bonus — and you’ll see how surprisingly easy it can be. The book is written so you can try it on any six-to-eight string instrument, and it even works with the unusual ‘Inverted Fifths’ bass-strings tuning.

ShareThis